In today’s episode, Chad sits down with guest Mike Mortimer, co-founder, and partner of London-based GHO Capital. Mike has had a distinguished career in healthcare including senior leadership roles at Quintiles, board positions with numerous healthcare companies including BioAgilitx, and for the last six years with GHO Capitals. At Quintiles he was a part of the team that grew the company to be the dominant late-stage CRO in the industry and now at GHO Capital, his team directs funding to build the future of healthcare with a focus on European investments. They chat about the business side of the pharmaceutical industry, his thoughts on Brexit, and biking over 2,000 miles! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Molecular Moments Episode 4: Mike Mortimer Talks Brexit, Biking and Business! transcript powered by Sonix—easily convert your audio to text with Sonix.

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Announcer:
Welcome to the Molecular Moments podcast.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
In today's episode, we sat down with our guest, Mr. Mike Mortimer, co-founder and partner at London based Capital. Mike has had a distinguished career in health care, including senior leadership roles at Quintiles board positions with numerous health care companies, including biogenetics. And for the last six years with GE Capital at Quintiles, he was part of the team that grew the company to be the dominant late stage crew in the industry. And now at GE Capital, his team directs funding to build the future of health care with a focus on European investments. Mike and I had a great discussion about his career, which followed a very interesting trajectory, as we see with so many of my guests. And he gave me the opportunity to see a glimpse into the financial side of the pharmaceutical industry that many scientists don't ever delve into. Also, on the mind of many around the world, we got an opportunity to get some of Mike's thoughts on Brexit. And of course, we took a little time to learn more about Mike's favorite ways to spend his leisure time. And without further ado, here is the fourth episode of Molecular Moments. I'm like, thanks for joining me on molecular moments, this is my fourth episode, really excited to have a guest who's a non-scientist this time.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
So so far I've focused on speaking with scientists, but I'm really excited to have somebody come at this health care industry from a little bit different direction. Maybe you could just give me a little bit of an overview of your career and how you ended up in the health care space and in this role and go with financing and things like that.

Mike Mortimer:
Sure. Thanks, Chad. It's great to be here and be with all of you today. I had a long and winding road into health care. I actually started in telecommunications early in my days right out of university. I then went into financial services and then ended up at a company called Quintiles in 2003 and really had a great experience at that company. I worked with roughly twenty five thirty thousand professionals that were solely focused on creating better outcomes for patients. Patient focused. It sounds a bit corny, but they were trying to make the world a better place and from that experience set that roughly 11 years there, I decided to stay in health care and take that experience and create a company with two partners that invests in health care companies that are doing health care better, faster and more affordable with Quintiles.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I'm curious because Dennis Gillings, quite frankly, is kind of the known guy, right? I mean, the founder and really the driver, a lot of that. But you had a big part of that growth as well.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I'm curious, a little bit more specifically about what your role was with Quintiles.

Mike Mortimer:
It was a great team and it was a small group of us that were privileged enough to run the company over that 10 or 11 years while we were private. And my role specifically was I ran all the back office administrative functions based out of North Carolina. And then in 2009, I moved to the UK to run Europe, Middle East, Africa and Latin America.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
When you started, one of the items that I noticed on the website is you have a European focus and your London based. So what's the motivation to put forward that European focus for your investments?

Mike Mortimer:
So it's a void in the market in the US, North America, you have a number of private equity firms that are investing in health care and they're excellent at what they do in Europe. You really don't have anybody that was really focused on investing in a small, medium sized health care companies that were primarily focused on Europe. So I got together with my two partners we created. And what we do is slightly different than what you see in investment firms in the States. We look for opportunities in Europe that are doing health care better and try to bring those businesses to North America and North American businesses that we bring into Europe. And biogenetics is a great example of a business based in the US best in class. And we're helping the management team bring that best in class offering to Europe.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Since you brought up BioAgilytix, something I've wondered and a lot of our conversation is going to be me as a scientist asking you as a as somebody in that other side of the business, some probably naive questions, but how does a deal like that sort of come together?

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Right. Kobe is interested in biotech politics and they bring in something like that. Can you explain that to my mostly scientific audience a little bit?

Mike Mortimer:
Well, you know, these kinds of projects are never kind of linear. They tend to take long and winding roads. We saw as a firm saw biologics many years ago when we were invested in another business based in Canada. And we always wanted to be a part of the biotech story for a variety of different reasons. That didn't work out. But we got to know Jim Dayton, the CEO of biogenetics, quite well over several years. And when the opportunity came to invest in biogenetics, we were privileged enough to be able to work with the management team and KOPA to back the management team and their next chapter of growth. Great experience. I think Jim and the management team pulled us into the deal and we brought a little bit more deeper domain expertise in health care than the corporate team had to date. But again, there are really strong team and they know health care exceptionally well. We just gave that a little bit more incremental edge to the business. And I think our European footprint will help and has helped expand the business into into Europe.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Well, one of the executives of BioAgilytix is, you know, I am not a full time podcaster. I can say that we're fortunate for our ownership team. We really appreciate that.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I've been through in my CRO career with a number of companies being bought and sold by private equity in and out some of the big. Is KKR was an owner, my previous company, and going public and private in a couple of different ways. Whenever I talk with folks about that, they think of companies as they think of Pretty Woman, right. The the eighties, buy and break them up. The Bear Stearns stories, things like that. How is what you do in the private equity world and the capital investment world today different from those stories of the 80s that we think of?

Mike Mortimer:
Well, you don't look old enough to have actually worked in the 80s. But I think what's different, at least in our firm, I can honestly say I worked in a private company for 11 years and we were quite large. And I saw, I think in that 11 years the best of private equity in the world of private equity and the best private equity is when it creates jobs, it creates opportunities for employees. It creates unique service offering for your customers. And it actually does have impact on society. I think what's changed is there is a lot of focus on ESG that focus on contributing or giving something back to your community, I think is top of mind for many, not all, but many private equity firms. And there's no better place to do social good than in health care. And I think you can see and biogenetics and other firms are great examples of where investors can make a profit, but also provide a benefit to society.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I appreciate that I certainly every day I have calls with multiple different pharmaceutical companies, and a bit ago I was talking with a device manufacturer about home collections related to covid and so many cool things, there's just not enough time to do them all.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
So it's yeah, it's exciting to be a part of a company that that supports that. Getting back a little bit more, generally speaking, when you guys are faced with an investment or an opportunity. Tell me some of the things you look for in health care companies that I touched on this, but maybe you can just dig a little deeper into that.

Mike Mortimer:
Sure. The first thing we look for is the strength and depth of the management team. So we won't invest in a business regardless of how good the financials are in a dysfunctional management team or a management team that has to you have to change. We look for strong management teams with good, strong management teams. You can take pretty much any business and do great things. So starts with the management team, starts with the sector subsector in health care that that management team plays in a bit about the the company and the geography they work in. And can we internationalize that business? Can we grow it from, in some cases, southern Europe to Northern Europe or from Europe to the US or the US to Europe?

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
How is all of this business changed in 20 20 with covid? It wouldn't be a 20 20 podcast without a pension of covid somewhere. Right. And I'd really like to understand how covid has changed and evolved your thinking over over time and how that affects your twenty twenty one planning.

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, it's really strange. And 20 20 spent a strange year on a lot of different levels. But as we look at 20, 20, it was an unusual year because in the early days of covid in the March, April time frame, the kind of work that we do in the investments that we were making virtually shut down. Post April May, the growth in the number of opportunities, health care opportunities that came into the market was exponential. So many of our advisors are doing more than double the work that they did in twenty nineteen. So you have a lot of companies coming into the market. And what's changed for us is the ability to sit down with management teams and talk about how we can work with them to create value in their business. We're important relationship firm and those relationships are really important for us to establish and build. And that's been probably the toughest thing we've had to face this year, the inability to meet not only with new relationships, but also with our existing management teams.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
You're in the US today, but your London base. So you've gone back and forth a bit. How is that worked in covid? I mean, business aside, what are the realities of traveling to and from the UK now?

Mike Mortimer:
Well, I've done it now twice this year and it's surreal to be on a plane with only 20 people on it, on the entire plane is pretty incredible and the airports are empty. I think what stands out the most is really kind of the different attitudes towards health and safety. I live in central London. It's like any other big city. But being in in Raleigh or being in New York, you know, the attitudes are just they tend to be in the US, at least the places I've been much more focused on wearing masks, washing your hands, social distancing. I recognize that's not the case everywhere in the US, just the places I've been in the UK. You walk down the street and nobody wears a mask. You go into the grocery store, nobody's wearing a mask. And that was as of maybe a month ago. So the mental attitudes are just different as you'd expect in various cultures. But it's been interesting to watch and interesting to see how various geographies have kind of coped with covid. I had an opportunity to go to Denmark recently and there you kind of ask the question, pandemic? What pandemic? You'd never know that anything was different. Restaurants were full. There is no social justice. There is no mask. There is no place to wash your hands or sanitize your hands. But at that time, it was safe there. So it's been a very unique experience.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Yeah, we've certainly seen that. Looking at the Global Labs across BioAgilytix, the differences and in Durham, in Boston are significant, but especially when we talk with our colleagues in Hamburg and how they're dealing with it and how the city and the government it makes for makes for interesting conversations, to say the least.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Like you say, it's a a bit of a fascinating social experiment. And there's there's probably to be many, many PhDs and so many different subjects written not related to the experiences of twenty twenty, whether it's social or social or epidemiological or virus vaccine or everything.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
So I'm curious about one thing from your career. And because I live in Overland Park, Kansas, Sprint, a sprint was on your at least on your LinkedIn profile. It's kind of looks like where you got an early start in your career. Would you do a sprint? And did you come down to Overland Park much? I don't think you lived here, did you?

Mike Mortimer:
No, I didn't. I was actually in the management development program there, so I had rotational assignments throughout the Sprint organisation. I worked on the telecommunication satellites and tracking those, and I worked selling long distance services and dial up modems, everything soup to nuts. It was a great experience. I got down to Overland Park quite often and great city and it's kind of place you move and you never move out of. You know, it's very family friendly.

Mike Mortimer:
And it was a great experience because I think what's important, particularly for non-scientific people to get a depth and breadth of experience that you bring to a situation. So I think the work I do today, if I hadn't had that sprint experience, I don't think I'd be as good as I could have been. And I'd say the learnings from the telecommunication industry and from the financial services industry, we applied to the quintiles experience and the success that we enjoyed there.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
You mentioned moving to Quintiles. What drew you into that health care field? Was there was it just the right job at the right time or was there was there something else kind of drawing you that direction?

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, I came from a company, Charles Schwab, that was founder led and driven, and I worked directly with the founder there and an amazing individual that had built this company from scratch. And that experience had run its course. I had a number of international assignments. And then I was asked to come back to the. And work on US domestic programs, and that wasn't what I wanted to do, and I got a call from someone they wanted me to meet this guy, Dennis Gillings, and talk about this company that did drug development outsource services, a company I never heard of in my entire life. I never even knew the industry existed. But I think it was two things that drove me to Quintiles, actually. I think one was Dennis and his personality and his vision. Internet brokerage is interesting, but it really is kind of you can do it a lot of different places. And I wanted to do something different and meaningful and I wanted to start making a difference. I had been fortunate to have a number of different experiences that now I could pick what I really, really wanted to do. And third, I think the opportunity at that time you could see that outsource services and the pharma industry or biopharma industry were just starting to to really kind of take shape. And I thought it was just an amazing opportunity to participate in something fun and interesting, new and different.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Yeah. You know, it's interesting that you say that it was kind of just that fortuitous opportunity and things line up. I think, about when I got into the pharmaceutical health care industry, it wasn't really it was more about an interesting company where I could run mass spectrometers and play with these really expensive toys that I thought was cool. And then as I got into it and started realizing what I was doing and what the impact was, and I worked on one drug in particular, I guess I probably shouldn't name, but I had the opportunity in my career in my first S.R.O. that I started in discovery with those projects and sort of developed the assays and was running samples. And then as I moved into project management and then management, that drug moved along and it got approved shortly before I left that company. So was sort of even though I wasn't with the Pharmaceutical Development Group, it was so amazing to just see that progression. And obviously it's always stuck with me. But those those stories and you think about the patients, the patients it makes an impact on. And the more drugs you see, you go through the system, the more you think about while we supported those drugs and having been at Quintiles, you guys probably touched half, three quarters or more of the drugs that were approved in the last 15, 20 years. So that's really, really amazing, actually. A bit more like maybe you touched every one of them at some point.

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, I think that's really what it's all about. And I have a tremendous amount of respect for the people that have the technical ability to take and work these really minuit problems and create life changing drugs and life changing therapies. And as we emerge into selling gene therapies and all the vaccine and RNA work that's going on now, it's just this is an amazing time to be in health care, an amazing time.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
And I hope the rest of society, outside of the space, outside of drug development, realizes the amount of collaboration.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
And we work every day with competitors in what I what I say to the non-competitive spaces. Right. How can we be better in ways that just help society, you know, ultimately help our business. But that's the way that we're able to do some of these really rapid advances. Right. BMR and vaccines, as we talked about, one of the participants in this call I had earlier today with the home collection is a competitor of ours, but they're offering something different to the relationship than we are. And it's just going to make it better for everybody. So on your side of it, do you see the same sort of collaboration again on that on the financial side of it?

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, you do see a lot of partnering. And I think that different firms have different behaviors and different cultures. But you do see partnering and I think our relationship with Co-op is a good example of that. We don't view ourselves as competitors, per say, but there are situations where we'll look at an opportunity. They'll look at that same opportunity, and there's other situations where we'll look at opportunities together.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
One of the big topics that I wanted to talk to you about is Brexit, your London based.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
You're focused on Europe and then Brexit comes along. Now, I've found a significant irony in inviting an American to join him for a discussion on Brexit, and it seemed like about the most American way to go about it. So but but I think you can have some great insights for us. So maybe just lay out what you're seeing and how you've been feeling, how that's evolved over the last three years. I think it's been since Brexit was voted in.

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah. In short, it's a mess and it's been a mess for many years because there's been a lack of strategic direction and or intent. I think that governments are confused. The people are confused, companies are confused. But I think there are a couple of things that are specifically related to health care that we are starting to see more clarity. So on supply chain is a concern that many people had. And I think covid has been a good test of supply chain. So many businesses in the UK. Had to adapt their supply chain to kind of the new covid environment, and many people have come away thinking that this could be a model in a new post Brexit implementation era. So supply chain disruption, I think, has been sorted. And the companies that we've invested in and the companies that we work in seem to have come up with solutions to ensure that there's constant steady supply chain so that they can actually do API manufacturing, CDMS, Okemos, that sort of thing. I think the regulatory climate is also something that comes up quite often. And as you think about the MHRA and their scrutiny over the UK and then the EU regulators, the good news is it looks like the MHRA is going to default to EU dossiers so that Reub kind of comes out of the system naturally, which is, I think for many of you on this call and the biopharma industry, a good outcome.

Mike Mortimer:
As you think about kind of wrinkles in the system. You have this odd situation with Northern Ireland. So Northern Ireland, I just did my I'm I'm getting UK citizenship. So I've just gone through my knowledge, tested the UK, so I actually know this one. Northern Ireland is a standalone entity and outside Brexit. So as it relates to kind of the EU regulatory environment, Northern Ireland will be in a EU regulatory environment and the UK will be under MHRA. So I think there might be some confusion around that that wrinkle, but we're confident that that'll get all sorted. And actually that may actually be a benefit. And some of the concerns around supply chain and distribution and manufacturing gets sorted as a result of that arbitrage between the two geographies.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Well, that have an impact. You talked about supply chain. I wonder if we'll see if that'll cause supply chain to flow through Northern Ireland.

Mike Mortimer:
There has been discussion around floating supply chain through Northern Ireland. But actually what's happened is that there are other paths across the channel. So instead of going to KALLET, they're going farther north into some of the northern cities to avoid some of the backlog in these ports because the goods need to be inspected and they sit in these carparks for weeks until the border force can inspect these cargoes, whereas if they go to other less popular ports, they tend to get processed a bit more quickly.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
It seems like most of what I've read the feeling is that this is not good for UK pharma. Maybe some of the clues you've given us say it's not going to be as bad as first thought. What have you seen on biotech funding specifically then between Europe and the UK? Have there been changes or impacts there that you're following?

Mike Mortimer:
I think one of the big impacts that Brexit will have on the UK is people. So the ability to take talent from continental Europe and bring them into the UK easily will be much more difficult going forward if the demand for talent in the UK is huge. So I think talent is probably the biggest issue that the UK will face as it relates to Brexit in health care.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Yeah, well, I don't think that's a unique challenge.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I know we've been hiring rapidly BioAgilytix and there's a wealth of scientific talent in Asia. And the challenge of getting visas right readily, which would only cause our business to grow, is becoming an increasing challenge. So so, yeah, a challenge probably isn't unique to the UK, but of course with Europe so close and a destination, I think a lot of people from Europe would like to work in the UK and would like to move there. That yeah, it'll be interesting to see how that evolves a bit.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
So the M.A exits London Jizo that a year and a half ago or so and they move to the Netherlands and I guess I don't know if the I don't know if the MHRA just moved into their offices or how they work. They're probably not, but. But how do you think that's going to affect then having the M.A in Europe? How does that affect London directly? Maybe the environment is what I'm talking about, sort of the pharmaceutical environment and just not having that presence. Does that just sort of drop the presence of scientific talent overall in London and cause a knock on effect in that way?

Mike Mortimer:
I think that talent, good people in health care will find roles and they are attracted to some great companies that they have that are based in the UK. You've got a lot of biopharma development going on in Oxford and Cambridge. You know, the latest Oxford. AstraZeneca vaccine is a is a good example of collaboration between the university and industry, John Bell is someone we know in our firm exceptional. He drove that and he is all about creating more new companies in the biopharma space in kind of that Oxford, Cambridge area. Obviously, you've got GSK. Pfizer has got a large presence in the UK and obviously the AstraZeneca. So I think that the EMEA going to Amsterdam is unfortunate, but the economy and the system will, I think, absorb those jobs.

Mike Mortimer:
And the MHRA will they'll continue to take over, you know, sometimes different types of forces, as you say, sort of force an issue. And I was reading I think it was in The New York Times this morning about the potential impact of the Pfizer vaccine being made in Belgium and then being having to be shipped to the UK. And I can imagine that that is the type of driver that could cause very quick adjustments or decisions made around the import export laws for pharmaceuticals. So hopefully that's a positive outcome, right. I can't imagine the UK would put up a block to something, you know, to to the vaccine coming in from Belgium. But it'll be interesting to see how that develops.

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, there's not a politician on the planet that that wants to mess with people's health care and access to health care. So I think that politicians in the UK are very sensitive with that topic. And I think it will sort itself. How it sorts itself is unclear. But I do think that calmer heads will prevail and common sense will prevail in the end.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
You made one comment. I'm just curious about here. You said that you're you're getting your UK citizenship now, so moving away from Brexit a little bit. But I'm just curious if you don't mind sharing what what motivated the UK citizenship and are you able to be a dual citizen then US, UK or do you have to give it up?

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah, dual citizenship, dual citizenship and living and working in the UK a long time. And to a certain extent I guess it's a badge of honour and to a lesser extent it gives me a little bit more flexibility to work in the UK. So instead of being on a work visa, I can more freely come and go.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
One of the things I really enjoy talking to all of my guests about is, is mentoring. And in the scientific field, of course, I'm very aware of mentoring. And you you have your PhD advisor and they're your mentor. And so there's this sort of natural progression, sharing and developing. I'd be interested to hear from you kind of your experience of mentors and mentoring and how that works in your field at any given point.

Mike Mortimer:
I usually have to sometimes as many as three people I like to work with and mentoring is about a relationship. You can't force those things. So there are individuals that I like to work with to help them achieve their full potential. And I think helping talented people improve is is something that everybody should do, regardless of kind of your position, whether you're scientific or not scientific, it's kind of paying it back a bit. So the kinds of people I typically work with are either younger people that are trying to get ahead in either non-technical roles typically and want to move from a technical role into a managerial role, which is sometimes really, really hard to do, because what's been ingrained in you as a scientist or someone in a technical capacity is often counterintuitive to what you need to do in management and leadership. And there's obviously a difference between management and leadership. So oftentimes people with deep technical backgrounds have great managerial skills, but they don't have good leadership skills. So helping them with that leadership be real, be yourself, be there in the moment, be yourself is is something that, you know, we talk a lot about. So that's part of it. The other end of the spectrum is I work with people that are actually farther along in their careers and I talk about a good, better, best continuum and creating a force multiplier. So taking a CEO like a first time CEO and helping them polish what they do in this new role that they're playing so that they can be that force multiplier, they don't have to do everything that they did in the prior role. They need to identify good talent. You don't have to deliver the goods, rely on other people to be there for you and with you. So that's what I do with the people I tend to mentor.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
I was talking with a former colleague last night a little bit about this. We just happened to have the topic.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
And one of the things we were talking about is often people don't want to take that accountability. They're afraid to take the accountability into it and to make the decision because they don't want to make the wrong decision. And she and I were both saying that that's something that's helped us in our career. Sometimes it gets you into trouble, right? You make the decision, you put your foot out there and they put your hand out there. Sometimes you get burned. But for the most part, I think it's really helped me in my career. And that goes back to advice that I got long, long ago. The other thing that resonated, actually, a lot of what you said right now, it resonated. But another thing you mentioned that did really stick with me as a scientist is when I first took over a responsibility, profit loss, responsibility for the department. We had a CFO at the company at the time that grabbed me. And he said, hey, Chad, you need somebody to teach you these financials. You need somebody to sit down and really understand this and walk through this. So he said, we're going to you know, we're going to we're going to sit down every week. We're going to go over where we're at. It's going to seem repetitive.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
But you got to learn the words. You got to learn the lingo. You got to you got to understand what these you know, at that time, I really didn't know the difference between revenue and profit and Hiebert and all these different terms that are so second nature now. So that that was a really key mentorship in my life that helped gave me a little bit of financial literacy. So I just find it so invaluable. I find it so enjoyable to have the chance to work with people and I hope with covid and all the working from home. And as that's going to change and continue to have people working from home, I hope we can figure out a way to continue to have watercooler conversations and things that are going to lead to these mentoring opportunities, because, like you say, they they can't so much be made as they need to kind of sprout up organically. So you worry about that in the office, right, if you're not bumping into people. The other thing I'm always curious to hear about hobbies and interests. And again, 20 20 question, do you have any new hobbies you've picked up or have you focused on anything in twenty twenty with covid that's kept you busy?

Mike Mortimer:
Yeah. So I'm going to toot my own horn. I'm going to be proud of the fact that I did two thousand miles on my road bike this year.

Mike Mortimer:
I'll never do it again. But I was able to ride a bike two thousand miles this year because I was working from home and forced myself kind of at the end of the day on nice summer afternoons to ride a bit.

Mike Mortimer:
I don't think I'll ever be able to say that again, but I did it this year and what a great activity. I think that's what we saw, especially back in April, May, or you were sort of either locked in your house or you had to get outside and do things outside. And so many people gravitated outside. You saw so many families out doing things because they weren't doing it with everybody else. Right. Mike, I really enjoyed talking with you. I want to give you a chance to hit any highlights of anything I missed from your role in biotech to Brexit, the mentoring, anything else? Maybe you want to say hi to somebody out there. You're you're on the podcast. So any any closing thoughts or ideas you want to share with us?

Mike Mortimer:
I think that now has never been a better time to be in health care. Just if you think about the global need for health care and great health care right now, it's never been a better time to be a part of that story. I've been fortunate enough to work and with a couple of great companies, like a.

Mike Mortimer:
Quintiles like a BioAgilytix that are really, truly doing some some life changing things, and that's something that all the employees that contribute to that should be proud. And it doesn't matter if you're the receptionist all the way up through the CEO, everybody's making a difference. And I think that's really important to remember.

Mike Mortimer:
I think the Brexit stuff will sort itself out one way or the other. It'll be all OK. It's going to take some time. And I share your want, need, desire, Chad, to get back and have some social contact with even people I don't like. Yeah. Anybody be fine about now, but no, I think better days ahead. And I look forward to continuing the journey with biogenetics team, and it's been a great experience. Thank you for the invitation, Mike.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Thank you once again. Thanks so much for joining and thanks for everything you do for biogenetics. Really, really appreciate the time.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
That is all for Episode four. If you enjoyed today's episode, please be sure to subscribe an Apple podcast, Spotify subscribe like write us check us out on all the favourite podcast app so you never miss a conversation. If you'd like to hang out with us outside of the podcast, we have many webinars and other presentations available for enjoyment and education. Visit biogenetics dot com to see what's coming up and how you can stay in touch. And don't forget, keep an eye out for Episode five. This is going to be our final episode of the first season of Molecular Moments. We'll be sitting down with Dr Tina Morris, president of the American Association of Pharmaceutical Scientists, where we'll get some insight into the challenges and opportunities of running a scientific society in twenty twenty. And we'll also be doing a special year in review, a wrap up of the scientific highlights from Twenty 20 through Mind and Tinas Eyes. Thank you so much.

Dr. Chad Briscoe:
Molecular moments would not be possible without the support of our sponsor, BioAgilytix Labs BioAgilytix is a global contract research organization specializing in large molecule bio analysis based in Durham, North Carolina, with labs in Hamburg, Germany, and Boston, Massachusetts, biogenetics provides high quality biomedical services to leading pharma and biotech companies around the world. They offer assay development, validation and sample analysis under Nanji LP, JLP and GCP, as well as GMP quality control testing. If you are looking to work with a team of highly experienced scientific and kuai professionals through all phases of clinical development, look no further than biogenetics. For more information or to speak with their scientists today, visit their website at BioAgilytix.com.

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